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WinDev Forum
Beiträge im Thema:
18
Erster Beitrag:
vor 1 Jahr, 3 Monaten
Letzter Beitrag:
vor 5 Monaten
Beteiligte Autoren:
Steven Sitas, Yogi Yang, Harry W, Amal Murali, Mitz, Peter Holemans, Gary Williams, GuenterP, Biju, Ola, Al, Fabrice Harari

Announcing "Open Source" applications for WINDEV/WD MOBILE

Startbeitrag von Steven Sitas am 27.04.2016 11:46

Hi,
In the very near future, my company is going to publish a series of applications developed with Windev technology.
The purpose of these apps will be to educate and offer developers a starting point for the development of new and more complete apps.
The first apps will cover a general POS and a Hotel front system, developed with WINDEV 20 and their accompanying mobile apps.
The desktop apps will target windows and the mobile apps will target android and windows10 (universal apps).
We are also planning iOS and WEB apps using other technologies (mainly JavaScript), but this could change in the future …
We have done extensive work on the Documentation, the Data Models (Analysis) and the Internationalization of the apps and they will be published as “Open Source”.
Of course since WinDev isn’t itself an Open Source product, someone could say that the apps aren’t really Open Source and they would have a point. So what we are really saying is that you can use the apps in any way you want (study them, use as is, change them, resell them etc.) without any restrictions.
At the same time we are going to offer, for anyone interested, payed consulting services for the applications.
Right now we are busy implementing the infrastructure (Microsoft Azure) to support the project and as soon as everything is up, I will do a repost.
In the meantime if anyone is interested or has any questions (or ideas), just email me :
stevensitas at computerplus dot gr

Steven Sitas

Antworten:

Hi Steven, this is a very great idea! Thank you!!

von GuenterP - am 27.04.2016 16:23
Hi Steven, Great !...


Biju

von Biju - am 28.04.2016 06:01
Hi Steven,

This sounds wonderful! Highly appreciated!

best regards
Ola

von Ola - am 28.04.2016 10:51
Hello Steven

The developers on this forum have a long history of sharing information and helping each other and your proposed effort expands that tradition in a big way and is very welcome indeed - thank you.

Regards
Al

von Al - am 28.04.2016 20:39
Sounds like a great idea Steven.

I am only 2 years into my WX journey so probably not best placed to assist with WX technical issues, however I do have 20+ years developing Hotel & EPOS solutions and before that I was in Hotel Management, so if you want any industry specific advice I may be able to help.

Gary.

von Gary Williams - am 29.04.2016 05:53
Hi,
Thanks to everybody for the kind words and sorry for the long post that follows !!!

To answer some questions– from emails and posts on this forum – here are some answers (to obvious questions) - note that the MOST important answer is at the END of the post:

1. The code will be 100% free. I don’t know what kind of term to use for the license (since open source may not be appropriate with WX designed products), but I don’t think that we will have a problem here …

2. We will have compiled apps – for anyone that doesn’t have the current WX version - to download. These compiled apps will be limited in some way so they can’t be used as is. The reason we are doing this is that we want WX developers to build their own applications even if this requires just a recompile of the source(s). Of course we can’t stop anybody – with a WX license – to recompile the apps and offer them as free downloadable apps, without any kind of limitation.

3. Although someone would need a WX license to actually use the applications, we think that the Data Model(s) and the documentation of the design ideas will be very useful as is. And they of course will not need any kind of WX license.

4. The web site supporting the project is developed with WEBDEV. At the beginning we were going to use a 3rd party solution, but it didn’t fit with everything we were planning to do. We are waiting for a stable version of WEBDEV 21 to go online.

5. All our support and the documentation will be in English.

6. What do we mean with the term POS system? This will actually be a small ERP that will have the functionality to work as an autonomous POS (like a cash register).

7. What about Replication? In designing the product we have followed MOST of the guidelines/ideas of Fabrice Harari and his excellent open source WXReplication. So for complicated things WXReplication will fit nicely with the apps.

8. What about WX OO, Classes etc? We have decided NOT to use the OO features of WX, mainly because we think it is easier to communicate our ideas in a classic procedural type of implementation. At the same time we are avoiding the problems that rise from features that are not supported across ALL WX products.
There is an excellent paper by Peter Holeman, in PCSoft’s repository that presents the use of classes etc. in a WX product and someone (maybe with some help from Peter) can use the ideas and implement them in the apps.

9. We had some questions concerning the consumption of WEB Services by WX products. The only thing we can say is that there is NO problem with WEB Services developed with WX products – they all work very nicely together. We also have/had problems using public WEB Services and what we did/do is actually read the documentation, test with SoapUI and copy everything over to our products and use SOAPRunXML(). Not 10 times faster but it does work …

10. And now the really BIG question – what do you really want to do? Is this just it? A POS system and a hotel system and some documentation?

Not really - we want to make an ecosystem of developers, retail stores, hotels, businesses and consumers that will be part of MANY SMALL, LOCAL, INDEPENDENT and DISTRIBUTED MARKETs. The apps will AUTOMATICALLY PUBLISH their products/services THROUGH the MARKETS. NO data will ever be sent to any kind of external databases, they will just be accessible DIRECTLY by consumers through mobile apps or WEB Sites. The data will always reside on the business server/computer (or in the cloud). Think of many eshops, in a common place (MARKET), accessible by consumers, without the business ever needing to implement any kind of eshop.

Where do developers fit in? They can use the apps, as a base, to develop compatible apps with the DISTRIBUTED environment. We all know that a single app cannot fit all business needs. It’s up to them and the free market to develop and sell them to their customers.

Who will control the INDEPENDENT MARKETS? Everybody could implement a Market. They would of course have to find businesses to participate …

What would be the cost for a business to participate? I really don’t know. Other than paying the developer to purchase or implement their base software (POS/Hotel) that would be up to the INDEPENDENT MARKETS to decide.

Are only WX apps supported? No, the apps can be implemented with any kind of technology that supports our distributed model. Technically even a SAP implementation could support the model.

And to be a little personal..
This is an idea that has been in my mind for many years, and I think that the public infrastructures and the technology in general is ready to support it. Even the social environment is ready to support solutions that help small businesses make a comeback against bigger and more aggressive companies.
I don’t know - at the end - if everything will work as planned. Maybe something that I haven’t thought about will be too big to overcome. What I do know is that with the help of a community of developers, many of whom are a lot brighter than I am, the project is more likely to succeed.

Thanks everybody for contacting me (or reading my posts) and I will keep the community informed as things progress.

Steven Sitas

von Steven Sitas - am 29.04.2016 14:02
Hi Stevens

welcome to the club :-)

Best regards

von Fabrice Harari - am 29.04.2016 14:15
Hello Stevens,

How much longer before you publish your open source code?

Just curious.

Regards,

Yogi Yang

von Yogi Yang - am 09.05.2016 05:06
Hi,
As soon as we get a stable release of WebDEV 21 (English version).
According to PCSoft that would be sometime in June 2016.

Steven Sitas

von Steven Sitas - am 09.05.2016 12:50
Quote
Steven Sitas
As soon as we get a stable release of WebDEV 21 (English version).
According to PCSoft that would be sometime in June 2016.

Steven Sitas

Does this mean those who are having WX older than 20 will be left out in cold?

I am asking this because WX is storing its projects in binary format and this is not backward compatible. So any old WX owner will not be able to open newer version WX projects.

Whenever such a situation comes up I always wish WX something way of exporting its Projects in a version neutral XML format and facility to import the project in any version of WX. Such features are available in many dev tools. For example we use RealBasic which has this feature.

My 2 cents.

Regards,

Yogi Yang

von Yogi Yang - am 09.05.2016 13:08
Hi Stevens

Great Work!!! Expecting it soon...

Best regards

Amal Murali

von Amal Murali - am 11.05.2016 07:56
Hi Yogi,

I have a similar request running for years with tech support (abilty to save generated source code, import generated source code, provide open file format like MS, ...).

Tech support informed me that the number of requests for a certain feature determines the likelyhood of it to be implemented.
May I therefore ask that you raise a similar enhancement request (Option: Make a suggestion)?

TIA,

Peter Holemans

von Peter Holemans - am 11.05.2016 08:03
What happen to this development? almost a year now...We are excited to see the results... :-)

von Mitz - am 15.03.2017 12:10
Hi Steven,

I will be very grateful to you for sharing your projects but why are you doing this?

To promote PCSoft products or .....?

von Harry W - am 15.03.2017 12:24
Hi Mitz,
you can go www.alpha360.biz and see the progress of the project.
We have already posted version 0.7 [WINDEV Open source _and_ WINDEV PRO]
In 2 or 3 days we are going to post v0.8 [WINDEV PRO].
This one is the commercial version (for developers) and it includes the INTEGRATED POS functionality.
After that comes version 0.9 that is NOW ONE PROJECT and includes the WINDEV and WEBDEV implementation. So you can compile for WINDEV and WEBDEV (from the same project).

Since the initial introduction, we have received hundreds of "requirements" from developers from different countries and different industry sectors.
We have tried to include most of the requirements and this took more time ...

At the same time we had to "freeze" documentation, because things where changing rapidly _and_ the WEBDEV implementation - specially the UI - was more difficult than we thought it would be. But this is the nature of the current WEBDEV product and it is something we have to live with.

Now our current plan, is to introduce v1.0 (WINDEV and WEBDEV) before June 2017 and the complete documentation also.

Steven Sitas
www.alpha360.biz

von Steven Sitas - am 15.03.2017 12:39
Hi Harry W,
please note that we have commercial versions also.
Having an open source version _and_ commercial versions is an "industry trend" that seems to work - specially for small developer companies.

The only problem is that our WINDEV/WEBDEV implementation is targeted to WD developers that already have at least version 21. And this limits our audience.

Our .net core implementation has a "larger audience" and is probably more "fit" to the Open Source industry trend.

By the way, we have NO direct connection to PC Soft and saddly we haven't even received an email from them about the project !!!

Steven Sitas
www.alpha360.biz

von Steven Sitas - am 15.03.2017 12:49
Hi Steven,

Thanks for the reply and the good work.

von Harry W - am 15.03.2017 15:33
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