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Informationen zum Thema:
Forum:
WinDev Forum
Beiträge im Thema:
8
Erster Beitrag:
vor 11 Monaten, 1 Woche
Letzter Beitrag:
vor 11 Monaten, 1 Woche
Beteiligte Autoren:
Piet van Zanten, Allard, Yogi Yang, ccc2, Philippe SB, Danny Lauwers, Harry W

Will Webdev ever get rid of the html tables?

Startbeitrag von Piet van Zanten am 15.12.2016 17:37

Hi,

After wasting many hours on RWD I started evaluating if my effort really had a chance of success.
I hate to admit it, but no!
I cannot expect my client to pay for so many hours, without optimal result.
While the use of html tables has been deprecated since HTML5, Webdev 21 still uses them for the layout.
A page can have hundreds of td tags.
It seems to me that this is the source of most problems with design in general and responsive in particular.
This Christmas tree just has got too many branches.
Unfortunately to head back from this dead end road, PCSoft need to basically start from scratch and start creating clean css based pages.
In the one year update cycle they have committed themselves to I don't think this will be possible.
Unless (and I really hope so) they have a parallel development line somewhere that they will of a sudden pull out of their sleeves.
So I have a hard time believing Fabrice's prediction that a few versions ahead it will be alright. (Even if I had the time to wait that long)
As the whole back office of my client is based on Windev/HFSQL I'm stuck to Webdev, but real responsiveness seems out of reach.
For now, dynamic serving seems the only way to go.

Best regards,
Piet

Antworten:

Hi Piet,

When you are developing a Webapplication (Not a fancy website), do you really need a responsive design ? You can do a lot with anchoring and it keeps things simple.

If your Webapplication must be used on PC/Tables/Phone and you need to adapt layout, content etc... then you will need responsive design like it was introduced in WB21.
But I think the nature of RWD itself is more work intensive, I guess in other web languages creating responsive designs is also much more work intensive that a fixed layout !

Has anybody had some experience in other development tools and writing RWD pages ?? How does it compare to WebDev ?

And I also hope PCSoft will optimize there HTML generator to create better HTML and CSS especially for the more complex pages.

Danny

von Danny Lauwers - am 15.12.2016 18:02
Hi Danny,

Really need RWD, this is a webshop and my client wants it just like the competition.
With WB21 this seems impossible.
The biggest problem is that the position or anchor of a child element of a cell can have an impact on the position and/or anchor of the parent cell.
This will NEVER be the case in pure css/html5.
I need to be able to trust that the parent will NEVER change its behaviour based on its children.
Another simple example:
A row of 4 images in a cell. The cell is set to left align, horizontal anchor adapt to browser, vertical anchor adapt to content.
When shrinking the browser width the 4th image will go to the next line, but centered.
Further shrinking will move the 3rd image to the second line, centered and the 4th image to the third line left aligned (but a bit more to the right than the first image. The images are in cells that have the exact same size and vertical position.

So first:
X--X--X--X
Than
X--X--X
----X
Than
X--X
----X
-X
This looks really crappy, and it took me more than one hour until I gave up.

Best regards,
Piet

von Piet van Zanten - am 15.12.2016 18:37
Windev is a great tool.
I don't know about WebDev.

Go for Windev + MSSQL or MySQl.
Makes you less independent from one tool.

von Harry W - am 15.12.2016 22:00
Hi Piet,

First sorry for my english but I'm in Reunion Island so my natural speaking is french. :xcool:

I agree with you, the use of html tables has been deprecated since HTML5, Webdev 21 still uses them for the layout. I told PC Soft that they have to change that, but I think they don't want to hear anything about RWD. They told me: "The product works fine and our clients are satisfied with it !!!".

Now I'm using Netbeans and php to make my website.

There's an opinion poll here (http://www.developpez.net/forums/d1617089/environnements-developpement/windev/nouveautes-chez-pc-soft/)

I know, this is a french post but it could be interesting that most people answer it !!!

Philippe

See you

von Philippe SB - am 16.12.2016 05:52
webdev is not the only one. others also , even though claiming fully html5, if you look at the code , you will know they are not.

even so, you don't see problem running on browser. that because no browsers are fully html5 support.
https://html5test.com/results/desktop.html

von ccc2 - am 16.12.2016 06:25
Quote
Danny
Has anybody had some experience in other development tools and writing RWD pages ?? How does it compare to WebDev ?


If you use mendix or out systems responsiveness comes out of the box. It realy does. No need to do anything!

Hi Piet,

You a right .In webshops this iskind of essential. More and more people order stuff on the web with their tablets and even phones!
People sit on the bank and want to buy somethin g then tahey take the tablet for it is easy sitting on the bank. ( then they still can watch tv and shop as well ) Ha ha

For other applicions normal web with anchoring is good enough, but that is wat I think.

But a dashboard that would be nice if it where responsive for that is what one would look at with phones as well. Real work is done with big screen

regards
allard

von Allard - am 19.12.2016 12:23
Hello Piet,

I don't know much about WB but here are a few useful links for you:
Link 1
Link 2
Link 3

Interesting Link..

HTH

Yogi Yang

von Yogi Yang - am 19.12.2016 12:42
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